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north London

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Good place. I worked there for about one year :wink:

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Were you thinking of this? :henry2:

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Good call! :wink:

Aye, North London is best London. :laca::hipster:

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God bless Enfield. Fuck Haringey, Tottenham and Seven Sisters :hipster:

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The far right believe in the extermination of certain races or peoples. Until I’m aware genocide being a unifying, core far left principle I’m going to say that you’re almost totally wrong in saying they’re just as bad.

Criticise them by all means, I’m not saying they’re faultless by any stretch, but to say they’re just as bad is seriously misguided in my opinion. It feels like almost the perfect example of a false equivalency.

Also, Chomsky’s criticism is made in the narrow context of Charlottesville. Whatever other shit antifa might get up to on other occasions, and I don’t claim to be hugely knowledgeable on their activities, within the context of Charlottesville they don’t merit criticism @Cristo. To say they’re not better than fascists is completely fucking misguided imo.

I doubt anyone here equating them to fascists would have a problem with them coming to your neighbourhood and fucking up fascists like they did at Cable Street. If you are vehemently opposed to fascists that is. To say “oh just leave it to the police” is just about one of the whitest, most privileged centrist things someone can say. A comment like that is a signifier that you’ve always felt like the police exist to protect you. I doubt people in marginalised communities would be so confident of just waiting for the police to step in and defend them.

The fact is also that antifa is a hugely decentralised group. They have no leadership structure really to speak of, they’re a mixture of people from different schools of political thought and are spread across many different countries and have a history dating back to the twenties. The only unifier is that everyone involved is anti fascist. IMO that makes it rather hard to coherently criticise every person involved in the movement as being one thing or another, because within that group you have: thugs who want to cause trouble, people who simply think we must take direct action against fascists, communists, anarchists, people from Black Lives Matter and others. Antifa is basically an umbrella term, it’s not a centralised organisation.

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This is a good post but I didn’t articulate myself well enough and I also never read Chomsky’s article. I just meant in the context of discussion and debating. My comment was completely misplaced and just me throwing out general thoughts and feelings. And it has nothing to do with ideology or anything because I’m clearly more aligned with the left than I’d ever be with the right.

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The authoritarian right and authoritarian left are just as bad as each other. Authoritarianism has lead to the rise of nazism and comunisim which has lead to the death of millions. This is why disagree with both ideology that’s why to me Chomsky is right. You can’t get violent with those idiology inherently advocates for violent and is prepared to use it. You using violence to directly combat just cement and reinforce they stance.

Plenty of examples from history that kinda of prove that you can do exactly that.

Sometimes violence is the only appropriate response.

However me saying that is broadening the debate somewhat and I was talking about a more specific context.

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That was a similar battle to Cable Street’s. Everyone bar antifa was backing fascists (police and army as well). What should they have done? Let them through?

One of the Arditi’s most important successes was in Parma in August 1922, when 350 arditi, directed by the World War I veterans Antonio Cieri and Guido Picelli, successfully defended the city against a 20,000-man fascist offensive headed by Roberto Farinacci, who would join the Grand Council of Fascism in 1935, and Italo Balbo, one of the four main planners of the March on Rome. The Arditi benefitted from massive popular support in this task

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Unless police behaves like SS.

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Do you want more?

Michelangelo Fournier, Genova’s police vice chief in 2001: “it was a slaughter”.

Police beat journalists, students, priests up.

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Yes there are many times in history yes where violence was needed, but authoritarian left like the right believe in attacking first. Preemptive attacks is why most of the world hates America the whole attack them before the attack us sort of makes us like them. Hence left or right authoritarianism is bad

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2 attacks tonight… One in Brussels where someone tried to stab soldiers and another at Buck House.

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Fuck! Again! :frowning:

My wife works on the train lines in that area. Thankfully she was on the train a few stops behind.

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What the hell, 50-60 flights a day. My flight Monday morning got cancelled ffs, luckily I’ve found another airline. Never flying with this lot again :rage:

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Course you will. They’re cheap as fuck.